Why was my Blue Board entry hidden? (Staff: investigating non-payment report) Thread poster: Carlos A R de Souza
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Hello, everyone,
this month, things have been a bit more difficult than usual. I had to give a negative review for one of my clients (which will not be named as per the Proz.com policies). They claimed they had a problem with PayPal, and asked for two more weeks. I asked what problem it was, and they could not specify it. Those two weeks are now a month, and I have two invoices due. This forced me to leave negative feedback on the Blueboard. After 2-3 days of waiting, 15 minutes lat... See more Hello, everyone,
this month, things have been a bit more difficult than usual. I had to give a negative review for one of my clients (which will not be named as per the Proz.com policies). They claimed they had a problem with PayPal, and asked for two more weeks. I asked what problem it was, and they could not specify it. Those two weeks are now a month, and I have two invoices due. This forced me to leave negative feedback on the Blueboard. After 2-3 days of waiting, 15 minutes later the review was hidden because Proz support staff said they wanted to contact the client. I then asked for an update, but so far nothing yet.
After not receiving a reply from the support staff, I filed a support ticket, and after a few hours, I noticed it had not been assigned to anyone.
I'm at a loss (literally). Can somebody help me with this matter? I have nobody to run to, and my bills are piling up. ▲ Collapse
| | | | Michael Newton 
United States
Local time: 13:35
Japanese to English
+ ...
| Blueboard review | Dec 14, 2021 |
It is a fact of life that some agencies have outsized influence.
| | | | | Did you enter a non payment report? | Dec 14, 2021 |
In my experience the staff take seriously a non payment report by contacting the client, this often works in order to receive the payment, because with 3 non payment reports agency is banned from posting jobs
P.S, Staff is probably waiting a reply from the agency, I suggest to ask them via the ST, how many days they are supposed to wait.
[Edited at 2021-12-14 07:52 GMT]
| | | | | Payment Practices | Dec 14, 2021 |
I suggest you post a review at www.paymentpractices.net, which is uncensored, to warn others. It costs $20 a year, but it's well worth it.
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| Reports on corporate member records are closely investigated | Dec 14, 2021 |
Hello everyone,
I see that support staff member Karen replied to your support request yesterday, Carlos, the same day you submitted it.
In any case, as Karen explained, non-payments reports on corporate member Blue Board records are closely investigated by site staff to help the translator and the client to resolve them before they go public (this is also explained in an automatic notification you should have received after making the entry). For the case you mention,... See more Hello everyone,
I see that support staff member Karen replied to your support request yesterday, Carlos, the same day you submitted it.
In any case, as Karen explained, non-payments reports on corporate member Blue Board records are closely investigated by site staff to help the translator and the client to resolve them before they go public (this is also explained in an automatic notification you should have received after making the entry). For the case you mention, since there was no answer from the outsourcer within the first 48 hours, your entry was made public and your non-payment report activated.
Also, yes, as Angioletta states, staff take very seriously all non-payment reports. And, no, no agencies have outsized influence at all. ProZ.com has a termination policy for outsourcers that applies to everyone regardless of name, record or membership status, https://www.proz.com/termination_policy
Hope this clarifies.
Have a nice Tuesday everyone!
Lucia ▲ Collapse
| | | | | Non-payment issues | Dec 14, 2021 |
In over 35 years one hand is enough to count the number of times I haven’t been paid: two direct clients and three translation agencies, always small amounts. Of course, over the years I had a few delays and some have been solved with Proz help.
| | | | | A few clarifications. | Dec 14, 2021 |
Lucia Leszinsky wrote: Hello everyone, I see that support staff member Karen replied to your support request yesterday, Carlos, the same day you submitted it. In any case, as Karen explained, non-payments reports on corporate member Blue Board records are closely investigated by site staff to help the translator and the client to resolve them before they go public (this is also explained in an automatic notification you should have received after making the entry). For the case you mention, since there was no answer from the outsourcer within the first 48 hours, your entry was made public and your non-payment report activated. Also, yes, as Angioletta states, staff take very seriously all non-payment reports. And, no, no agencies have outsized influence at all. ProZ.com has a termination policy for outsourcers that applies to everyone regardless of name, record or membership status, https://www.proz.com/termination_policy Hope this clarifies. Have a nice Tuesday everyone! Lucia
Hello, Lucia!
Yes. Karen explained it takes up to 48 hours for you to investigate when the agency has a Corporate profile.
Maybe it'd be best if this was clearly spelled out on default message.
Honestly, I don't like filing non-payment reports, because it affects the trust with the agency. I've worked with them for quite a while, and there are very nice people out there.
But payments have been delayed for longer and longer, and I've had a few agencies where this happened and it was not a good sign. I do hope they sort it out, because the success of us translators depends on healthy clients.
I'm strongly considering though changing my payment practices, because agencies are supposed to protect you to a degree when an end client does not pay. The way it is now, the translator not only gets all of the liability, but all the risk as well.
Teresa Borges wrote:
In over 35 years one hand is enough to count the number of times I haven’t been paid: two direct clients and three translation agencies, always small amounts. Of course, over the years I had a few delays and some have been solved with Proz help.
To a degree, it's a matter of luck, both for the agency and the translator. In general, I tend to have long-term relationships with my clients, but I have been unlucky this time around.
| | | | Edward Potter
Spain
Local time: 19:35
Member (2003)
Spanish to English
+ ...
If you've been collaborating with the agency for a long time I wouldn't be so quick to get upset by a couple weeks delay in payment.
I've had the same experience as Teresa. In 20+ years in the business, I have less than 5 instances of non-payment. Late payment is almost the norm in this business and I have a healthy tolerance for it. On occasion I have to prod in different ways, but in the end I get paid.
It really sounds like you will be getting paid, albeit late. If ... See more If you've been collaborating with the agency for a long time I wouldn't be so quick to get upset by a couple weeks delay in payment.
I've had the same experience as Teresa. In 20+ years in the business, I have less than 5 instances of non-payment. Late payment is almost the norm in this business and I have a healthy tolerance for it. On occasion I have to prod in different ways, but in the end I get paid.
It really sounds like you will be getting paid, albeit late. If that is unacceptable to you, wait until the payment comes in, then don't accept any more work from them. End of story.
Good luck! ▲ Collapse
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Edward Potter wrote:
If you've been collaborating with the agency for a long time I wouldn't be so quick to get upset by a couple weeks delay in payment.
It really sounds like you will be getting paid, albeit late.
Since it's been a month now and they are unable to provide any reason, it doesn't sound good to me.
Edward Potter wrote:
Late payment is almost the norm in this business and I have a healthy tolerance for it.
I don't tolerate that sort of slacker client. I deliver on time and expect them to pay on time, except that I have a few days' tolerance. Some of my clients pay before the due date. There is no good reason why they shouldn't pay as agreed. If they can't figure out how to do that, I tell them to go comb monkeys (Portuguese expression that means to get lost and stop bothering me). I have work enough to fill my time without tolerating that sort of abusive business practice.
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Edward Potter wrote:
If you've been collaborating with the agency for a long time I wouldn't be so quick to get upset by a couple weeks delay in payment.
I've had the same experience as Teresa. In 20+ years in the business, I have less than 5 instances of non-payment. Late payment is almost the norm in this business and I have a healthy tolerance for it. On occasion I have to prod in different ways, but in the end I get paid.
It really sounds like you will be getting paid, albeit late. If that is unacceptable to you, wait until the payment comes in, then don't accept any more work from them. End of story.
Good luck!
Edward, your reply was a bit rude because it doesn't consider that I have a payment cycle here too. You ask your electricity bill to pay 3 months from now because your client hasn't paid you, and with translation is no different. Plus, that is a slippery slope. Why not a 2-month grace period? Or 3? Why not 6?
Of course, like I said, it's not in my interest to simply cut ties with the agency. It doesn't please me to write a Proz.com review telling that a client hasn't paid, especially when I've worked with them for a long time.
But like Thomas said, it's only fair that we are paid on time. Inflation on the US dollar is high, and it's not easy for us translator to raise prices. We need to put food on the table every month.
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Angie Garbarino wrote:
In my experience the staff take seriously a non payment report by contacting the client, this often works in order to receive the payment, because with 3 non payment reports agency is banned from posting jobs
P.S, Staff is probably waiting a reply from the agency, I suggest to ask them via the ST, how many days they are supposed to wait.
[Edited at 2021-12-14 07:52 GMT]
The problem arises when agencies do not post jobs on Proz. I had one such agency this week. I submitted a negative rating and site staff probably contacted the agency immediately as I got paid at once but the agency does not post jobs on Proz. The rating still serves for others whom the agency will probably contact, though and it's not a good reputation either.
| | | | expressisverbis
Portugal
Local time: 18:35
Member (2015)
English to Portuguese
+ ...
| Have you considered that... | Dec 16, 2021 |
Carlos A R de Souza wrote:
Hello, everyone,
this month, things have been a bit more difficult than usual. I had to give a negative review for one of my clients (which will not be named as per the Proz.com policies). They claimed they had a problem with PayPal, and asked for two more weeks. I asked what problem it was, and they could not specify it. Those two weeks are now a month, and I have two invoices due. This forced me to leave negative feedback on the Blueboard. After 2-3 days of waiting, 15 minutes later the review was hidden because Proz support staff said they wanted to contact the client. I then asked for an update, but so far nothing yet.
After not receiving a reply from the support staff, I filed a support ticket, and after a few hours, I noticed it had not been assigned to anyone.
I'm at a loss (literally). Can somebody help me with this matter? I have nobody to run to, and my bills are piling up.
... the problem can come from PayPal itself? Something similar happened to me before. Eventually, I found out the delay in my payment was due to my PayPal account has been inactive for a while.
Sometimes, we can seem "rude" (I haven't seen that in Edward's answer), but I believe we just need to understand what is happening.
Are you paid within 15, 30 days of the translation’s delivery, from the date of invoice? (I can consider 30 days a reasonable payment term from a translation company, but this is just my humble opinion).
I think it would be fair to get paid after delivering the translation and invoice, just as with other services provided by other businesses.
True, everyone needs to fight every day to put food on the table, and pay the bills.
In the meantime, I hope you got your payment, and sorted everything with your client.
[Edited at 2021-12-16 00:57 GMT]
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Tony Keily
Local time: 19:35
Italian to English
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| Patience. And being a pain. | Dec 17, 2021 |
Teresa Borges wrote:
In over 35 years one hand is enough to count the number of times I haven’t been paid: two direct clients and three translation agencies, always small amounts. Of course, over the years I had a few delays and some have been solved with Proz help.
I'm also in the business for about 35 years and have never not been paid. If payers get lazy, I just make it my hobby to get them in line. Sometimes you have to make them see that paying is easier than not paying!
What I would say to Carlos is that patience is required. I get what you're saying about having your own commitments, but that's not really how these things work. Sometimes you need patience and persistence. I resolved my last payments issue after about 11 months. But I got there!
[Edited at 2021-12-17 17:08 GMT]
| | | | Edward Potter
Spain
Local time: 19:35
Member (2003)
Spanish to English
+ ...
| Reasons for late payment | Jan 14, 2022 |
Tony Keily wrote: Teresa Borges wrote:
In over 35 years one hand is enough to count the number of times I haven’t been paid...over the years I had a few delays and some have been solved with Proz help. I'm also in the business for about 35 years and have never not been paid...patience is required. I get what you're saying about having your own commitments, but that's not really how these things work. Sometimes you need patience and persistence. I resolved my last payments issue after about 11 months. But I got there! [Edited at 2021-12-17 17:08 GMT]
In about 25 years my experiences have been similar. In reality, non-payment is not very common. I think my record was about 2 years before I got paid, due to an oversight in my accounting.
Another thing that causes delays with some clients is bad accounting on their part. Sometimes they just lose things. That is why it is important to have accurate accounting records of your own. Solving an accounting problem together often brings your business relationship closer.
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